UK.HelmfordLondon..39313% I find it quite plausible that ordinary people actually find fairness in pricing according to cost very attractive and well fair. Not being American I dont know my semi-automatic high-powered weapons at all well. Typical nit-picking scrooges.) Why have fare collection at all. One might say that of course they would say that. Fare evasion is fascinating and TfL have done a bunch of interesting papers on it over the years. And the operators are normally satisfied. Monthly passes indeed encourage transit use, but thats not wasteful. With a modern system, there is no extra inconvenience is actually charging according to how much you use the system. Your everyone else is the minority, and just as with your earlier wrong assumption, they might be tempted by a monthly pass but under your scheme there wouldnt be any point. In smaller operations, I actually encountered that the driver just counted the number of people getting on and off (well, that was in a midi bus, or even smaller one. Are you aware of the kind of thing they subjected Season Ticket holders to from the Home Counties? Contact emilia@chancellors.com to see how we can assist you. Answered in 5 minutes by: Solicitor: Jo C. Jo C., Barrister Category: UK Law Satisfied Customers: 82,725 Experience: Over 5 years in practice. Its empire stretches from Peterborough to Tonbridge to Bognor Regis and Brighton. But all rail travellers would. I certainly tend to see S-Bahn inspectors more than I used to. However, what Ive encountered more resistance about is the idea that people should just be able to walk onto a bus or train. New York would transition to a large discount through holding the monthly fare constant and hiking the single-ride fare Look at the fare compliance b.s. Webtfl fare evasion settle out of courtadvanced spelling bee words for adults. if someone from outside the metro drives and parks on-street they have to either meter or pay daily parking rates on a app. I have had the privilege of working with then,true professionals, who has used alltheir knowledge and effort, to reach the best possible solution for me, in record time. Is France really going to repeat this nonsense? Thisll be relatively broad because Im in a hotel bar in Berlin, not at home with all my notes, but generally the London experience is that fare evasion can be divided into two categories: the. No, simply untrue assumption, and I could easily make the opposite assumption, eg. I am of course talking about transit performance in how to move the largest amount of people at the lowest cost for the transit users and taxpayers. Settling case out of court (fare evasion) | RailUK Forums. I recently tried to make a trip that was 10 minute drive and came up with 1.5 hours on the bus (that isnt counting waiting time for the bus to arrive or in the waiting room between when I get there and my appointment) needless to say I drove. The most common example of fare evasion involves the use of another persons Oyster Card to get the benefit of reduced or free travel. Tear down these faregates. As you wrote, passengers should be able to get on and off trains quickly, with minimum friction. And London. application of binomial distribution in civil engineering eames replica lounge chair review eames replica lounge chair review At the end of the day they are more affected by a shitty public environment than the wealthy who can retreat to their upper middle class bubbles and not have to deal with the antisocial. UK.ManchesterLiverpool2578% You dont need to convince me that British fares are out of control. I know that Korea manages to make all of this work at low cost, but elsewhere in Asia, those sprawling, palatial stations with many exits get really expensive. Yes, though my employer (in as much as they paid my salary since a lot of the time I was on fellowship, ie. He was just pointing out a common activist position on transit in the United States. Or/and they think pay as you go is so hot, and so new. In the real-life Berlin, theres an entire subculture of fare dodging. And if you need proof just try asking Londoners versus Parisians about their own systems. Likewise, even though the Helsinki Metro is profitable, it works in conjunction with buses, trams, and commuter trains that are not, its just that theres an imputation of revenues by mode/operator offered in Helsinki and (sort of) Berlin but not in Paris. Finally, monthly passes are regressive for people with very low incomes, and uncertain cash flows, as they may simply not be able to make bulk purchases.. I have no idea why Stockholm has fare barriers. In any case, it should be clear that both Paris and Tokyo could be much more compact than they currently are. 3) Is evasion hard (i.e. Based on the statistics received with those means, the general pot gets distributed among the different operators. Anyway: the breakeven point for a zone 1-3 ticket is 48: the monthly is 158.30 with a travelcard, the peak single fare is 3.30. Intuitively most of the induced extra trips, in a monthly fee, rather than pay per usage system, will be very short trips, that are easily substituted by walking or biking. No one will jump a fare gate 10 feet in front of uniformed police officer. You are thinking of financial performance rather than transit performance. HL February 2021, I highly recommend BSB solicitors, they are professional and responsive. But Q4 is why you need the PERCEPTION of enforcement., Now I say perception here because THATS WHAT MATTERS. A Monthly Travelcard for zones 1-2 (inner London) is 134.80 (US$169.45, 150.96) Otherwise, you just get public transport as social service for people to poor to own a car rather than a general transportation service used by everybody. Today I interpret monthly passes a kind of rent-seeking among one group of transit users, who want other people to pay the cost for their transit use. But railways, especially ones that have to cope with a giant network, hardly ever run at a profit so all it really means is a horrible choice between running fewer services, increasing fares (on routes with lower traffic than the ones chosen by the commercial entities; yeah that will work but of course it will simply force these horribly inefficient lines to close) or other kinds of cuts, slash & burn etc. If you do Your argument against which kind of trips that are induced by marginal price costs of 0, just makes no sense. I will try to help with this. And it shows little sign of improving. Poor policing, public housing with anti social tennants etc etc, So spare me the must not have moral standards dictated to from the rich, because that includes you. And if occasional users see how much cheaper a monthly card is, they are more likely to think about adopting more regular transit use. Its difficult to get an ice cream truck into a subway station. One doesnt think, on the weekend or non-commuting period, whether to take a short or a long trip on the Metro, one thinks of the trips one wants/needs to take and might compare doing it by Metro, private car or taxi. We can see this in big cities built in the age of the car like LA, US sunbelt cities, Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane. Most people dont get on and off along the way. This split also had an effect on the policing of fare evasion, as checks used to be a LOT rarer on the S-Bahn than the U-Bahn or tram, and in my experience the inspectors also tended to be more lenient, letting people off with a warning if they had a passable excuse, which would never happen with the BVG inspectors. If you want to do an apples to apples comparison go find satellite data and use it. Thelawyer who dealt with my caseput me at ease straight aware and was professional throughout my consultation. A sizable proportion of riders who do not pay would just stop riding altogether, for one. E.g. Excellent services. FA November 2020, Wonderful experience. Now there are LOTS of ways of tackling Q1 Q3. 2019) (applying abuse-of-discretion standard to review the denial of a motion to amend to add a claim for punitive damages), review denied (Minn. Mar. IIRC it is Keolis who operates the appalling Southern network in the UK which cops the worst vitriole from passengers of the entire British network). Ireland..DroghedaDublin.116..3% Maybe I meant A15s? Let me grab my laptop and a beer from the hotel bar and Ill do a quickly summary of findings., Okay. Incidentally, another difference between HK & Singapore is that they are quite low-tax places, whereas France (and most EU) are high personal tax countries; one thus has a mentality that my taxes partly paid for this so one can start to resent paying excessively to use it as well. Some people will learn to dodge the inspectors, as is the case in Berlin, and thats fine; the point is not to get fare evasion to 0%, but to the minimum level net of enforcement costs. You will usuallybe asked to respond within ten days. Webboston college early decision acceptance rate 2025. Some people got so infuriated that they went and sat in the First Class carriages (!) There are also proudly dysfunctional people across the socio-economic spectrum. The panhandlers, subway dancers, public urinators, and worse are what drives people away from transit. Since racial identification is supposed to not occur in official stats. New Yorks 46 is still similar, esp. The mass transit (light rail) system is run by one agency, and the bus system(s) are run by others. The greater sprawl is mostly because Tokyo is the larger capital of the larger country, with more than triple the population of Paris in terms of metro area. Of course you need a good system. Every dollar that doesnt come to us, in terms of fares that should be paid, is a dollar that we cant improve in service, he said at a news conference in September, according to AM New York. In the vast majority of cities, no excuse exists to have any kind of overt fare control. Unfortunately, the problem of indifference to monthlies on urban rail is common around the Anglosphere. This was a great result and I could not be more grateful. Compare with S$120 in Singapore or about 80 for Paris (all zones I believe): We are seeing violence directed at transit systems around the world which weve discussed here recently (link below). Would certainly recommend. As to the rest of your post, it is pure econometric thinking of the kind that gives me a headache. $50 for a week pass, $127 for monthly, $1500 annual. In talking to Americans about fare evasion, I have found that they are generally receptive to the idea of minimizing revenue loss net of collection costs. le de France Mobility wants to improve service quality, achieve greater operator responsiveness, find innovative solutions and improve passenger information. Germany..Eberswalde.Berlin.1204%. If the next one is running, its so crammed you cant get on. (No doubt, partly econometric because of the cost-benefit calculation of replacing their antiquated coin-op turnstiles with something modern.). Fare evasion rate on Hong Kongs open, non-gated, LRT system in year 2002-2005 was said to be only 0.4%, but there doesnt seems to be any more updated data. They rely on people voluntarily going to the cash register and checking out. Its because the software can only remember so many trips, right? So its not really that Berlin doesnt care if criminals discourage ridership among law-abiding customers, its that Berlin doesnt treat every rider as a criminal who must constantly be watched and monitored. Try cutting the breakeven point to something starting with a 3 instead. Claim the Commute schemes can take the form of season tickets subsidies (STS), fare receipt claims, bike purchases, bus route subsidies, or petrol receipt claims if the job absolutely requires car transport. Once again we see actual efficiency (for the customer, prospective traveller) sacrificed for some CFO or CTOs notions of access. You know what you pay, and you wont get any surprises. Its funny that the US is all about making things run like the private sector. Its a proxy for lawlessness, for police racism, for public safety, for poverty. The sprawl exists. the Albtalbahn before it was converted to tram-train. We're pleased to announce the launch of our new booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk, which helps support the 95% of users would use an electronic card that you sweep when you enter and when you exit, and only know the price when they exit. The advice I received was always well thought through and was communicated promptly at every point. I suspect the reason Paris is capping-curious is precisely that the breakeven point there is so high it was 52 relative to buying tickets in bundles of 10 last time I was there. So I think a good reason that North American transit is a mess, is because of people argue so much in terms of common sense, are afraid of headaches, and argue with anecdotes on how people actually use transit. have been recorded, including against people with mental disability trying to validate their ticket with their disability discount count, with fare inspector questioning authenticity of the disabled passengers proof of disability, and MTR have defended these actions by saying they are allowed to use reasonable violence against those who suspected to have violated their bylaw. On similar basis Greater Tokyo is 2,788/km2 which is still quite dense compared to US cities or urbanised areas. Trains and trams are also PoP. I think its also right thing to talk about the sum of the three: Thats not my impression but admit I dont have direct experience for several decades now. As they push out, all non-frequent transit users, the support among transit-users for monthly passes is understandably high (a typical insider-outsider issue). This report puts forward a relatively simple Claim the Commute scheme as a solution to this problem. Similar remnants to Roslagsbanan and Saltsjbanan do exist in Germany as well. They were technically convenient before modern technology (and thus motivated historically), but today there is no excuse to not have payments per trip, and per distance (and preferably also extra in rush hour). Turned things around very quickly and were the most efficient solicitors I have ever dealt with. Finally, as to user satisfaction, you may well be correct if youre talking of the Brits/Londoners. The fare structure should then encourage long-term season passes, including annual passes, so that nearly all residents who take public transport have already paid. 2019-11-14 - 01:24 Henry. I had been using it for a few weeks when I was stopped by aticket inspector. While it would be much better to have density presented as a map with high granularity, the overall figures suggests that Tokyo is more compact and denser. The local newspaper reports how other commuters have missed work so often, theyve lost their job; how students have missed exams or holidaymakers havent made flights. monthly passes is that be encouraging heavy rather than occasional (mixed with biking and walking) use of transit, it encourages large geographical sprawl. At 20 km the single fare is $1.78 and the breakeven point is 68, which means the monthly might as well not exist. As far as I understand, in Japan it is common (maybe even law) that the employer pays for the passes of their employees. requires time or athletics) to do? I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. When I had an unlimited pass in New York, Id travel from Eastern Queens near the city limits to Manhattan for school on the weekdays, and go to Flushing on the weekends. The second is FAR easier to deal with than the first., This is because habitual evaders will ALWAYS try to evade. Just please stop being ridiculous. Whereas today the program is a net revenue generator if it halves subway fare evasion, a level that already seems strained, within ten years, assuming normal fare escalation, it will need to cut fare evasion by about 90%, which is a complete fantasy. The travelling public in the East seems a lot more happy with their experience than the travelling public you refer to in the West. In Paris, various classes of low-income riders, such as the unemployed, benefit from a solidarity fare discount of 50-75%. A fully As examples in this report will show, commuting agreements around the world are far more progressive with regards to the distribution of the costs of commuting. 3) Lost revenue from passengers avoiding system due to crime can be inferred via a safety survey. I see this as just an additional argument for lower fares off-peak. Finally, monthly passes are regressive for people with very low incomes, and uncertain cash flows, as they may simply not be able to make bulk purchases. It is you who is artificially creating a them versus us war, which is reminiscent of London where there is definitely a class that would never use the Underground. Rural mode-share collapse isnt about private vs public its about the mismanagement of regional cities and their relationship to their hinterlands. BSB Solicitors fielded my call in a very professional, courteous, and sympathetic manner, and helped plan a response to TfL over the course of just three working days. with modern technology varying fares dynamically by distance is very straightforward (with 1990s technology) and westerners would adapt very quickly. Im not sure about the Lokalbanan. In Switzerland, where consolidated fares have been in existence for more than a century, there are regular passenger counts. This is actually a win-win situation, because the operator gets the money early on, and the employer can save parking spaces. Heres (below) the usual b.s. The crime rate of immigrants in those countries is lower than the non-immigrant communities. Up to 20 million workers would see increases in real incomes. were honest, kind, warm and efficient. I am way out of date. Even my last, reluctant, trip there I was forced to take a very early bus from Brighton to Heathrow. You really have no reason to be making this claim. If you decide to plead guilty, you can choose to go to court or not. about improving efficiency etc that has been utterly discredited. I was worried he would bring the awful British views of public transit to the job, and sure enough, an extraordinary focus on fares and fare-evasion, increased policing and compliance, just couldnt be more wrong. I would wholly recommend BSB Solicitors for anyone looking for help with fare evasion cases. Multiple use of violence by these inspectors. Also, since you can technically board a tram with good intentions, if the ticket machine is full of cash already (or has a defect) you even have a good excuse. BART charges too much, runs too little service, and its stations are too deep underground. We discussed everything that happened and even thought was a hard case he built a strong defense we the results could not have been better. January 2019, Really great service and very professional. Two years ago, BART announced that it would supplement its fare barriers with proof-of-payment inspections, done by armed cops, and lied to the public about the prevalence of such a belts-and-suspenders system. I can only speak of Colognes system (and my bus and tram service to uni and the station) but Colognes busses and trams even have ticket machines inside. > I more or less agree but then if we compare Greater Paris with Tokyo, the former with very affordable transit and the latter with more expensive transit, then clearly it doesnt always follow, ie. In fact, all of these have had a more permissive stance that has been incrementally put in place in NYC over the past 2-3 years, and anyone who rides the train has seen it. to reduce road congestion for other road users (inc. other cars). And of course it is not the least ethnically discriminatory . Anyway, youre getting stuck in the weeds and one would almost think that is some kind of distracting argument away from the main game: affordable and equitable transit. Seattle uses a third way of incentivizing monthlies, in addition to low-income fare discounts and relatively affordable monthly passes; I am very pleased with the conclusion of my case. We are seeing more an more examples of clients being https://www.citylab.com/transportation/2019/11/public-transportation-security-safety-laws-protests-equity/602212/ I wouldnt feel comfortable hiking the monthly fare in New York at all until the pay-per-ride fare hit $3.50, maybe even $4. Development London. On the same principle, cities and states can discount fares on buses and trains. Boston, too, has its moral panic about fare evasion, in the form of campaigns like the Keolis Ring of Steel on commuter rail or Fare is Fair. Thats what a monthly/annual pass stands for. And on a separate point, building rail-based public transit to outer-suburban areas is essential in promoting densification in those areas, around the transit station, ie. So, you have to swipe-in AND swipe-out. In Seattle, we have an unusual situation. They might have a different scheme to purely private employers. It is still bad. > The norm here is that big cities fund urban rail out of fares; the U-Bahn breaks even here, and I think also in Munich. Until recently, the GoPass was a flash pass no tagging required. 2) Crime prevention costs Not that need to, the glocks they carry are plenty deadly. We base such a policy on international examples wherein commuting costs are also born by employers, the state, or a combination of employer, state and commuter. If theyre buying a book, theyre buying it near the office or at home, not in the middle. My other point is that Monthly or Annual Travel Passes are increasingly old news in the UK as Pay as you go with far capping is more popular, and also because 5 days a week commuting is on the decline. Yeah, but dont confuse yourself or others. My solicitorhas been extremelyprofessional and his confidence has put my mind at rest. Whilst I thoroughly enjoyed my travels in both countries, I was astounded by the cost of regional trains and bus and tube transport in the UK. In a country that has, stupidly, bet everything on London, GTR is utterly crucial to the national economy. Not least, via job access. Paris recently eliminated the zone restriction on certain Navigo cards thus reducing, in the most significant means, the previous disadvantage of those living further out and often less economically advantaged. The main way to encourage compliance is really to make it easier to follow the law than to break it. They While I agree with pretty much everything in this post, I think encouraging monthly passes is a mistake. So there is, or at least was, that kind of enforcement on this issue. Whats more, the fare inspection should be a low-key affair. Yeah, better than they used to be, but still expensive and some conditional travel. Id be extremely surprised. With regard to other countries in the Anglosphere, I think Singapore and London actually do have monthlies: Singapore has the Adult Monthly Travel Card allowing unlimited use of bus and train services for a month islandwide, for $120. The Wiki section on France is truly pathetic (not worth publishing or reporting but I am sure it was): A 2009 study found that the share of immigrants in the population has no significant impact on crime rates once immigrants economic circumstances are controlled for, while finding that unemployed immigrants tend to commit more crimes than unemployed non-immigrants.[83] A study by sociologist Farhad Khosrokhavar, director of studies at the EHESS, found that Muslims, mostly from North African origin, are becoming the most numerous group in [French prisons].[84][85] His work has been criticized for taking into account only 160 prisoners in 4 prisons, all close to northern Paris where most immigrants live. WebFare evasion from tfl which led to a court summoning. How did you come up with M16s?? More people either work from home one or two days a week or are often hopping between client sites or their own company locations throughout the week and which might not even be in the same city. Lets assume that a bus operator has one equipped vehicle for each size (standard, articulated). In such cities monthly passes do barely exist, and cities aim for a fair and efficient pricing system. I have an appeal against conviction for fare evasion by TFL tomorrow, do you have any advice? N.A (April 2017), Stay up to date with Criminal Law with BSB Solicitors, BSB solicitors, 2 John Street, But lets not pretend were talking about the best means of revenue collection. What a wonderful system! Any maintenance on these escalators requires wearing haz-mat suits. it seems it's a RA1889 prosecution ie Fraudulent use of a Freedom pass with the intent to avoid payment of the correct fare. Random inspections with moderate fines are the layer of enforcement, but the point is to make enforcement largely unneeded. Of course efficiency is important but it is not achieved by those approaches, no matter how theory predicts it. I more or less agree but then if we compare Greater Paris with Tokyo, the former with very affordable transit and the latter with more expensive transit, then clearly it doesnt always follow, ie. A better method is to ensure most passengers have prepaid already, by offering generous monthly discounts. Because the industry pushes such solutions onto the operators, and considering that the responsible ones have not much of a clue, they fall for it and get screwed. @Phake Nick Sorry that narrative is wrong, the pro-car consensus was if anything more dominant 1950-1987, highways and railways were actually paired together e.g. WebHow do I write a TFL fare evasion out-of-court settlement letter? > However, again one should compare the compact arrangement of Ile de France versus what happens with Japan & Tokyos laissez-faire development policies. CNRS/INSERM or something similar, a Fondation). In New York, the SBS system uses proof of payment (POP), but passengers still have to validate fares at bus stops, even if they already have paid, for example if they have a valid monthly pass. I was quickly directed to Mr Black who successfully plead my case and saved my professional carer! Fare is split between the different agencies. Every commute brims over with aggro. Turnstiles do not belong in any city smaller than about 10 million people. The third problem could be fixed if cities actually worked to provide public restrooms either free or at a nominal cost outside every station. Or visit an exhibition, see a show, a sporting event etc. Counter-productive user pays econo-rat bullshit. Its the nature of the mindset that believes it can avoid spending real money by improving efficiency (at someone elses expense/convenience, often far into the future) to think this way. WebOlliers Solicitors: Criminal Defence Law Firm Manchester & London Ive had fare inspection before on a 1 am commuter train out of Paddington before. The (old) UK system was the opposite of frictionless and it used to raise my temperature from rubbing up against it (not in a lacivious or frottage way! This report is by a NGO so almost zero chance of anything like it being adopted by a conservative government. In a country with a developed-country level of transit infrastructure, most travellers would not even look up the price before a trip. Makes the second point much less important, even to those minorities (those minorities are much less likely to be subject to this treatment in France versus the US). though my excuse was I was working out in the suburbs; at the end of my first year the M7 extension reached Villejujif, and simultaneously my old car was vandalised and also gave up the ghost) and helps the economics of those tens of thousands of modest restos etc. Double that figure, and the average number of commuting trips is 44 to 46. That is, about the Brit who is the latest guy charged with pulling NYC-MTA into order. Transit, even expensive transit, is nearly always affordable as is. Hi! Menu viscount royal caravan. London for example spends <2% of fare receipts on collection costs. And in general is entirely counterproductive. They claim such abuse could be costing the government hundreds of million in long term. On many buses, drivers just let it go and let passengers board without paying, especially if nearly all passengers are connecting from the subway and therefore have already paid, as on the B1 between the Brighton Beach subway station and Kingsborough Community College or on the buses to LaGuardia. As to your last para, that is even more econometric thinking that shows how warped it gets. In terms even an econo-rationalist (rational plan, Martin Kolk ) should understand: it works best when it is nearly frictionless. https://pedestrianobservations.com/2019/10/24/numerology-in-transportation/#comment-67419. But from a nation that does allows compilation of such statistics: A report by Statistics Denmark released in December 2015 found that 83% of crimes are committed by individuals of Danish origin (88% of the total population), 14% by individuals of non-Western descent and 3% by those of non-Danish Western descent. If thats something I do often, most of those will be free trips under the 45-swipe regime, regardless of whether I lose a few workdays in a given month. Find out more about the Single Justice Procedure and how to submit your plea. Its not very expensive at all! It seems a bit of a wasted effort otherwise, eh?, Oh, should of added, that this is why when youre designing your roaming checks youre really looking for how you can MAXIMISE the number of people that saw that check happen. You must submit a plea of guilty or not guilty within 21 days from the date of the notice. Another data shows, as of 2017-2018, among people using elderly traveler subsidy across all the public transit system in Hong Kong, only 0.11%, or 144 people, are actually abusing it. These activities are really not the same fare evasion really is something to be discourage, just not with batons. I understand why a transfer station should look like this, but Singapore has these enormous complexes with mezzanines even at non-transfer stations.

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